Willie Cahill is a legend in the sport of Judo having coached over 10,000 athletes (1,000 of them being national champions) and two Olympic teams over the course of an amazing 60 year career.
Mike Pechina is a product of Cahill’s Judo Academy having started there at the age of seven. A former All-American wrestler, he served eight years in the Marine Corp. His accolades include US champion, Pan American Silver Medalist, World Team, Pan American Team, All Military Team, and now coach. He is the creator of the up coming series “Subtle Judo”.
Sitting down with these Judo coaches, we could have interviewed them for well over six or seven hour’s straight. The depth of their experience and storytelling was almost surreal. We were able to get more than an hour in with these men that everyone affectionately calls “Coach”.
FightLikeAChampion: What role does the mental game play at that level?
Willie Cahill: At the Olympics, everyone is physically fit. They’ve been training the same as you. It’s the mental part that’s really tough. You could be the best athlete and physically ready, but are you mentally ready? This is where you have to get the people ready to compete.
Mike Pechina: It makes all the difference. Everyone who goes in there is on the same level. It just depends on that day. The champion one day could be out in the first or second round. If everyone goes in at the same level, it’s definitely a mental game from there. As I got older, I gained appreciation for the mental and strategy part of the game. It’s what leads to the creation of “Subtle Judo”.
FightLikeAChampion: What’s subtle Judo?
Mike Pechina: When I was a younger athlete in my 20’s, I was physically able to go for the big throw consistently. As I got older and the new crop of physical specimen’s began to compete, I had to adjust my game a lot where it focused on less big throws and
more finesse. The definition of subtle is “difficult to detect or analyze.” This is what helps us older guys keep the younger guys off of us (laughs). So I started to tailor it to fit someone with less physical ability and speed. It’s based more on leverage,
timing, and angles.
FightLikeAChampion: How do you develop people’s self-confidence and mental strength?
Willie Cahill: Well the main thing is that if an athlete is so physically fit to a point where they’re so focused saying, “Man, I’m in the best shape I can be. I’m prepared”. They’ve got to realize that they’re prepared and focus and have done everything they can. Then from there they have to build they’re own confidence. Sometimes when they compete, they’re so nervous, but I tell them that the guy you’re going against is just as nervous as you. So it becomes who attacks first. It’s like when I played football. You’re so scared before a game, but when somebody hits you, you say, “Ahhh, that wasn’t so bad. Let’s do it again.” It actually relaxes you a little more after the initial contact. If you prepare yourself to the best of your ability, and knowing that you’re in top physical condition, that sort of brings in that mental attitude.
I knew a Dr. Dahlkoetter, from Stanford University. She was the one that worked with Lance Armstrong for four years as well as an Olympic pole-vaulter. So I had her come in and talk to Jordan, a girl that was coming in and fighting for us, and it made a big difference.
FightLikeAChampion: Were there any techniques Dr. Dahlkoetter performed that stood out to you?
Willie Cahill: I think she makes them ask the questions. Like “what motivates you,” or “what are your fears,” or “what are you worried about.” Then she asks them questions that the can answer for themselves: “are you in the best shape you can be,” “are you in weight,” “have you done everything that can be done?” And just with that now it’s up to you to get yourself prepared mentally. Because you’ve done everything that you can. You’re at the peak of where you want to be. So that alone can bring the mental attitude up.
Mike Pechina: I always felt strong mentally when I felt that I did everything I could to prepare. It’s all in what you did to prepare and get to that point. You just let go from there. Win lose or draw, you don’t feel bad. You know you did everything you could for that event.
FightLikeAChampion: Can you take us through the Olympic experience? What do the athletes feel leading up to the first day of competition all the way to the end?
Willie Cahill: You know it’s the training that builds you up. The more you train, the more nervous you get especially when it gets closer to competition. Then you focus in on who your competitors are and you should know exactly how they fight. Sometimes you get some people that get so worried about how they’re competitors are going to beat them or how they’re going to beat their competitors.
In 1988, I coached the Olympic team in Korea. But I also took the team to Europe and Japan for International competition and we had one kid, Kevin Asano, a 60 kilo guy. He’d fight in different tournaments and he would get beat by guys from Brazil, Japan, and Korea. He would always get to that point, but never got over it. One time he was fighting and he got pinned. I just said stay there and don’t worry about it. He took the loss and when he got up I said to focus in on the bigger picture. So we went to Russia, and he beat them. This is 3 to 4 weeks before the Olympics. We got to the Olympics and what we did was first thing in the morning we woke him up at 6 o’clock and got him weighed in. Then after the weigh-ins I said let’s go get breakfast. Over breakfast we never talked about Judo. We just talked. He was from Hawaii and I was from Hawaii. So when we got to the tournament, we just waited for the doctor. A lot of times, you won’t know who the trainer is. He could be a trainer for the swim team or another team that doesn’t know anything about Judo. Me and Kevin were standing around and it started raining, and in Hawaii, rain is good luck. Kevin said, “Wow, it’s raining!” He then saw the doctor come in and found out he’s from Hawaii. He said, “I’m going to do it now!” He was with me, who’s from Hawaii, it was raining which is good luck in Hawaii, and we had a Hawaiian doctor; he felt at home. He then went on to blow everybody away. Relaxation was the key. Once he got to the point that he was relieved because he had something for him that was set and he’s not going to think about who these guys were that beat him before.
First match was the guy from Brazil and boom he blew that guy away. Next match was against Hosokawa, the Olympic gold medal winner in ’84. When he got thrown (Hosokawa), the whole place went “Wow! Who is this kid? He beat everybody.” Now he was going to fight in the finals. I gave a protest because there were three guys, two judges and a referee, and they’re all from the Far East. You’re supposed to have a guy from Europe and no guys from your own country. They said, “Well, no one is from Korea.” It doesn’t matter; they’re still from the Far East. They wouldn’t do it so they let them fight anyway. In the match, Kevin’s leading, there’s 20 seconds left and the referee stops the match calling the two judges in. Kevin’s on the front of his stomach, and the guy’s on top of him. All of a sudden, his coach says something in Korean and shifting his hands. I began to feel that it was a set-up. Kevin was on the bottom and he’s trying to come down and choke him. The guy said Kevin grabbed his fingers to pull the choke off. So Kevin lost the match because the referee gave a penalty bigger than the score.
FightLikeAChampion: Who were the top Judo players that you’ve seen in your career?
Willie Cahill: One of the guys was Yamashita (Yasuhiro Yamashita) from Japan. He was awesome. He was the best guy. He was undefeated. I don’t think anyone ever beat him. What made him strong was his attitude. For a bid guy, his technical Judo was a like a lightweight. He does throws like the lightweights do. He does them great. There’s another guy, Geesink (Anton Geesink) from the Netherlands who won the World’s. I met him in Arizona. He was a guy getting all the medals. One of his students, about four years later, Ruska (Willem Ruska), who was trained by Geesink and he came down to fight everybody. He also won the World’s. Geesink was really strong. He was a big guy and fought everybody. Ben Campbell, who became a U.S. senator, was a really good U.S. Judo player. He trained at San Jose State Univ. and then went to Japan and lived there. When I went to Japan in the sixties, every club I visited, there was a Judo gi hanging there. He’d visit all the clubs and leave a gi there.
Mike Pechina: It was never one Judo player. I could name a few. Yamashita, Saito, Sokolov, Jimmy Pedro, Mike Swain. There’s so many. Even the athletes of today, I’m impressed with how people are evolving it to new levels. Changing the techniques to what they need. The classical techniques may not work totally today. You still see classical, but it’s conditioned enough to work against the conventional European styles now.
FightLikeAChampion: Can you compare different countries Judo styles?
Willie Cahill: The Russians know a lot about Judo. When you go there it’s a different world. It’s like the stuff you see in movies, when people are sitting outside smoking and talking about Judo. Russian Judo is completely different. They have different grips. The Japanese Judo is really technical. They got the good Judo. They’re still the best. A lot of guys beat them, but in the end they seem to win the most medals. The good thing about the Russians is that they changed Judo. Judo can now come from any place. It’s not from one country. I think the problem in America is that we spend too much time learning one style, which is Japanese Judo. Every time we go to Japan to train, we live there for a while and learn that style, which is good, but then when you go back to successful people it’s the stuff they’ve done on their own. They develop their own style of fighting. Muhammad Ali fought different. Joe Louis fought different. If everyone gets their own style, it’s usually a lot better. When we went to Japan to train the first time, you always do things their way. But then you can’t. Each body is made different. You can’t teach a guy who’s a left handed fighter to do right sided throws. You’ve got to teach them their style first. If you take the best thing of what each individual does, then it’ll be easier for these guys to learn Judo.
Mike Pechina: I really enjoy the Europeans because they’re so out-of-the-box with their approach. They bring something different and re-invent techniques. They polish them up and make them useful today. The thing with Judo is that there’s not a dominating country anymore. It’s truly an international sport now.
FightLikeAChampion: It seems like MMA is taking notice of Judo players. Do think Judo is playing a role now and what’re your feelings on it?
Willie Cahill: I think it’s good. They’re really good at the mat and groundwork. If they mix it up with the Judo it’s good. They’ll do anything to take the guy down. If they have the technical part it would be a lot different. But then, they’d be fighting us [laughing]. With Judo throws, you really don’t need the uniform. You can do any throw you want with just one arm. A lot of people say, “Well, you need the gi”. That’s not true. You don’t need the gi. You can throw with your bare hands. If the guys has nothing on, you can still throw. What the mix martial arts people are doing is good, and it’s the reason I let them in to my club. I’ve known Caesar (Gracie) for awhile. His guys came in with him and were really respectful and just wanted to workout. It was really good because you get to see the other side of them. They can come back anytime. I get along with Royce and also Charles Gracie. The best thing is that if all athletes would come together, all sports would be a lot better. I’ll teach them what they want to learn. We don’t hold back. I think it’s better for the sport and for everyone else. My biggest problem with any sport or anything is the political part. You don’t want that style learning this because he’ll beat me. Well if you’re not better physically and mentally you won’t beat them.
Mike Pechina: I definitely feel Judo is a big part of the MMA just because the takedowns and lockups are very effective. Judo teaches you to coordinate your hips and feet properly. If you transition it from gi to no-gi, it’s still effective. It’s a great skill to learn from the lock up position. People are seeing how useful it is because of the stances. It’s ready as a stand up position that can blend strikes with standing throws and lockups. I think MMA is a great evolution in sports. It blends the modern combative scenario. It’s the closest thing to being in combat. What I like is that everything is unset and instinctive. I like when a lot of the MMA and grappling guys come through Cahill’s. We’ve had the Diaz brothers, the Machado brothers, and some of the Gracie’s come by. All of them were very good. I respect those guys a lot because they put it out there and compete.
For more info about Cahill’s Judo Academy in San Bruno, CA go to http://www.DaWave.com
For seminar info on “Subtle Judo”, email pechina@sbcglobal.net
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